I used to build kits for people, and 99.9% of them were:
1) over 65
2) On a fixed income
3) Couldnt see well enough to solder or had other health issues like really shaky hands, etc
4) Only wanted to use the transmitter to listen to their old time radio shows
5)Had no other way to get a transmitter built
6) Sure as hell could not afford $400-$1,000 for Mr. Hamiltons unit.
And when I had my eBay business I continually got emails from people I know were the FCC or some drone of Mr Hamiltons or the like. They always wanted to know how to get more power out of an AM25, or could we mount an SSTRAN on a high rise in the city for a pirate radio station. They wanted to know where I lived, how many kits I could build in a day, etc. Hello, I am an ex-cop, I know the tricks, stupid.
Now I can't paint the picture for you. The actions caused by the letters to the FCC have cut into a mrket where people could not and would not buy Mr Hamiltons unit to start with so it really had no effect of his business. I built plenty of these kits for people (again, mostly senior citizens) If I have a customer that needs a Ramsey or SSTRAN assembled and just plain can't do it, then I am building it!
Dang straight, I am pissed off and mainly because this action literally cut off people that merely wanted a simple cheap transmitter to use in their home (or nursing home as I have delivered a few of those) to be able to replay some of history's great radio shows. It's a shame that greed from a so called "part time hobbyist" did this.
Dear kitbuilder,
Let me say that I most certainly sympathize with your situation. That said, if you are an ex cop, then you certainly understand one of the most fundamental things about the way our legal system works: "Ignorance of the law is no excuse". If you were in the business of building kits for people, there was no excuse for not being aware of the FCC rules governing this activity. The rules are very clear. If you were just ignoring the rules because you felt you were in the right, then you have to accept the fact that someone could take you to task for it. The rules are the law, and the law applies to everyone. When individuals start obeying laws selectively, the legal system no longer works.
If you don't like the law, the only recourse you have is to work to get it changed. Unfortunately in this case, the likelihood of this actually happening is very slight. You would be better off to just modify your kit building operation to offer partial kits that the customer must finish. Although it may seem like a fine point, this is not unlike the practice of importing products that are only partially finished. This is the way most American companies that manufacture products overseas avoid paying hefty tariffs.
The FCC rules are not clear on exactly what would constitute a "partial kit" so I would suggest you either consult with them or with a lawyer.
You should know that the FCC funds a large percentage of its operations from fines and forfeitures. You are lucky that they only fined you a relatively modest amount. They fined Behringer Corp. $1M for selling non-certified products. Sometime you should check out the fines they levy every day on licensed radio and TV stations for relatively innocuous infractions, like not having their public record file available for inspection.
Instead of being bitter and angry, I would suggest that you just get on with your life and figure out how to accomplish what you want to do without violating the FCC rules. The rules are the rules-- sorry about that! I do understand your position and I hope things go better for you in the future.
WEAK-AM
Classical Music and More!
I agree with as well, and know that ignorance is no excuse. Actually, it wasn't really a "profit" business as far as the assembly fees went. I am working with an attorney and like most Federal laws, there are at least 10 ways to interpret them. Depending on the judge hearing the case and the legal counsel you could win or lose while presenting the exact same evidence. I'll lay it right out here. We are exploring the possibility of doing this under a non-profit organization name aimed at assisting the people that want one of these transmitters.
I am bitter and some of the comments I made were in anger (read that pissed off) but an honest opinion. It isn't like the 40 kits or so I sold last year really hurt Mr. Hamiltons business. He seems to have the ear of someone at the FCC but he should also remember that the ear may someday go away and be replaced by someone not so sympathetic to his cause.
Kitbuilder,
Let me start by stating that I do not know who you are nor do I know your circumstances.
From your posts it appears that you were supplying radio equipment which was built from kits as an assembled product to a market.
Allow me to state that I do not see any harm in anyone selling assembled kits and I am sympathetic to your intent but the current FCC part15 regulations clearly state that only certified transmitters can be marketed with an exception allowed for kits. An assembled kit is not a kit, it is a working transmitter. You and I apparently agree that this restriction may not be reasonable, yet it is codified.
Your alturistic intentions are admirable but it seems to me that going the nonprofit route is not going to be useful since the law makes no distinction regarding the profit status of those who market transmitters which are not certified.
Neil
by MRAM 1500 kHz
Would an interpretation of the rules allow a person to buy a kit and contract another to build it.
In this way, the builder would not be selling an assembled transmitter. They would be selling the assembly service only. You buy the kit, pay me to assemble it.
I can see that would slow the process but in that way, the assembler would not be selling the transmitter.
Neil,
I agree with you-- I don't see where the rules make any distinction between for-profit and non-profit organizations. The rules are intended to prevent the manufacture and sale of non-certified radio equipment. This is just no way that the FCC can relax this requirement. A fully-assembled kit is a working unit; no different from a product manufactured in its entirety. If the FCC were to allow marketing of non-certified equipment in general, it would create a huge potential for interference. You can imagine how quickly our country would be flooded with cheap products from overseas that could cause harmful interference to almost any kind of communications imaginable. There is no way the FCC is ever going to allow this to happen, in my opinion. One could perhaps make the argument that in this one limited case of very low power equipment operating in the AM band, certification is not necessary, but I doubt that the FCC (and certainly, the broadcasters) would be willing to risk the possibility of potentially widespread interference to such an important radio service.
Finally, there is no point in blaming Mr. Hamilton, if indeed his complaint was the cause of the FCC investigation in this case. Regardless of his motives, Mr. Hamilton was within his rights to bring the matter to the FCC's attention, as much as any other citizen who observes someone breaking the law. The FCC is a complaint driven organization. They can't be everywhere, but if someone makes a complaint they are fairly obligated to at least investigate whether or not it is legit. As far as I am concerned, you have no reason to be upset with anyone but yourself for breaking the law, especially when you knew it.
WEAK-AM
Classical Music and More!
Looking aside for the moment from how the rule is codified, so that we can consider ideas that might make it possible for some later modified rule to allow for assembly by a third party in at least some situations..
Mram, your suggestion might work with regard to addressing the concern of the market being flooded with cheap manufactured units as was already raised as a concern. If the assembly involved a very simple written contract between the actual purchaser of the kit and the assembler, I think that might be a way permitted if an exception was made for this sort of case in some later revision of the rules. The builder would have a copy of a contract requesting they build the unit, as opposed to say, having a stock of them prebuilt. It might be a way the FCC could make an exception without opening a wide door to abuse with cases like this specifically in mind.
So far as WEAK-AM's point of the market getting "flooded with cheap products from overseas", that can cause harmful interference, I would like to point out that this is already the case. Almost any discount toy store has "wireless mic" toys for AM or FM, and there are plenty of cheap imports easily available in many stores as "mp3 transmitters" and etc. *Most* of the ones I've seen have no FCC ID#. Oh, they'll still claim to be "FCC part15" usually, but in some cases they don't even bother with that. Maybe some of them are ok so far as sound and signal quality, but the ones I've bought and compared with my Maxell FMT-1 weren't worth the few bucks they cost. And it's not just little import places, I bought one a while back at a drugstore that is part of a major chain right off the hook next to actual FCC approved units and at a comparable cost. I'd rate sound quality as poor, the frequency stability as poor, and the range is about twice that of my legal part15 FM. For those interested, the brand name on the one I'm referring to is Vextra, and I didn't bother with writing a review for it because a.) No sign of actual FCC approval and b.) quality is too poor for anyone to want to use it for broadcasting music anyway. In short, it's junk. There have been quite a few discussions here and in other boards that have part15 interest about such transmitters being commonly available, and possible harmful effects it can have on us as regards the legal part15 hobby.
But my point is that the law is *not* actually keeping those non approved toys and etc off the market or off the air. I don't recall seeing any FCC actions against any of the "worse than Mr Microphone" type toys, and I'd be willing to bet that plenty of them aren't even vaguely compliant with the rules (even aside from not being certified/approved).
Now, any of the people that bought a kit that they'd had assembled could have gone out and bought some AM toy that was very cheap (I've seen them at the local Big Lots for less than 5$ over the years) and probably has a "less than clean" signal so far as harmonics and etc, and stuck the microphone near a speaker.. But from what I can tell, they wanted a *good* unit.
What were their other options? Buy one for several hundred or over a thousand (depending on options)? That may be very reasonable for someone trying to provide a small community radio station for a small town or area, or a resort hotel that wants their own radio station, or many other things.. But not really very reasonable for people where their interest ends at house/yardcasting or hearing their OTR recordings on a beloved vintage radio.
For part15 FM we are more fortunate. There are decent legal FCC approved units available in a similar price range to the illegal knock-offs. There is simply no advantage for someone wishing to run a legal part15 FM in using questionable gear. But vintage radios generally are AM, not FM and people wanting to hear them play their favorite OTR in their own house do not really have any reasonable quality/fidelity options at a reasonable cost.
It's a matter of the market. There is a high enough demand for small FM transmitters that it is worth larger companies' while to put them out and they do so in large enough quantities that the cost is low enough that they can offer them at a reasonable price. It's simple business.
So we are in the unfortunate situation that for AM, unless one builds their own station and is able to test to make sure it's compliant as per the rules and etc, then part15 is pretty much strictly a "rich kid hobby". Meaning that if you don't have at least several hundred dollars to put into gear, it simply isn't an option for you.
That is regrettable, since it discourages people from developing an interest or getting involved, and I am of the opinion that the trend does not bode well for the survival of part15 AM as a hobby. Historically, radio services that are not used tend to be shut down in favor of new services that might be of more interest. If we'd like to see part15 AM continue as a legal possible hobby, I think the best way to have a chance of that is to have more people involved. Sadly, if the impression a hopeful would-be beginner gets of the hobby is that they'd have to spend several hundred for a transmitter and however much for an Innovonics whateverthe#is and etc or they "aren't serious", or that the opening bid to play in this particular game is that high.. Well, I wonder how much longer there will be a part15 AM.
At present, the options for new people to join the part15 AM hobby are limited and tend to be expensive. Little is done by the few small companies that manufacture part15 AM gear to remedy that situation short of at the least several hundred dollars. Largely because they *can't* do much. Items where there is a very limited market simply are more costly to make and show a reasonable profit for. They have to be at least mostly hand-built, some parts can't be ordered in large enough quantity to bring the costs down to a reasonable margin, etc. I am not privy to the manufacturer's books (probably wouldn't understand them if I was), and while it's possible that units could theoretically be offered at prices a bit lower than they presently are, I rather doubt it would be a *lot* lower.
So the option for those with limited income is to build or turn away from this hobby (ok, or hope to find a piece of approved gear for sale in a price range they can afford, but that is not a reliable option). If a person has no prior experience with soldering and etc, the notion of homebrewing or kit-building for themselves would be quite daunting, especially in light of the size of the fines involved if they really botched it up and ended up causing interference and getting fined.
Not hard to see where there would be demand for a service such as Mr Mann was providing. Considering it takes some time to build the SStran kit, he certainly wasn't getting rich with what he was charging. But the laws as they are at the moment, it appears it is considered a violation. I have to admit, I was actually a bit surprised that selling the unit with the chips needing to be installed by the end user was *still* disallowed. But I'm not the FCC, and I don't understand their logic on that point.
Personally, I hope that the case works out eventually so that a reasonable precedent is set to better qualify what is legally considered a kit vs a completed unit or homebrewed, and hopefully that would allow Mr. Mann and others to build kits for others within some sort of reasonable limitations without it being considered illegal.
Considering that the ethical and legal considerations of the actual complaint have been argued at some length here and in many places, I have nothing much to add to that. But having reviewed the documents RadioPilot mentioned and also having seen the assorted discussions in various boards about the case, my personal stand is that I disagree with the actions of the person who filed the complaint and as such I wouldn't buy their company's products. Agreed they were "within their legal rights" to make a complaint, but I also have a legal right as a potential customer to choose not to do business with companies where I disagree with their ethics/actions.
So far as the often shouted "Ignorance of the law is no exception" argument.. you all are aware of *every* single law that you might fall under in the course of an average day? Seems unlikely to me considering the awe-inspiring number of them which increases every year.. The only people the "Ignorance of the law is no exception" statement has ever really benefited have been lawyers. In practice, some leniency is often shown by law-enforcement, judges and etc when someone inadvertently breaks a law or honestly misinterprets it. How a law is actually enforced is decided in the courtroom, not internet forums full of laymen like us. (At least assuming few if any of us are lawyers.)
Daniel
Neil,
I understand and I also know that I would have better luck rewriting the Bible than ever getting the FCC to change its mind about these kits. As up front as I can be, I didn't amrket them as assembled. I ended up building a few after people bought kits from me the realized that they could not assemble them. As I stated in my original post, the demographics for my customers spoke for themselves. The original complainant to the FCC stated that "he coud barely stay in business" because people were selling assembled kits. To be as plain language as I can; I call bullshit on that statement.
What avenue does a 70 year old man that wants nothing more than to listen to the Wr Of The Worlds on his 1937 Philco have? He lives on SSI, and maybe can't see well enough to solder. What does he do? The FCC, thanks to secondary complaints, doesn't consider installing the IC chips as a completing a kit. Hw much can on leave unassembled and what level of technical difficulty will the FCC require there to be before they leave this person alone?
And actually, we'll keep working with the attorney at hand, and perhaps someone with some deep pockets will challenge this regulation even further. A group of technicians working for a non-profit and meeting at a location with the owners of said kits may skirt by the ragged edge, but case law has been made and broken by people on the fringe.
I had read radiopilot's papers, and it surprised me to see how little the FCC did to conceal the complainant's identity. The name was blacked out, but the complainant was really left without any plausible deniability.
But it happened, and that is that. I think he regrets it too. Have you ever blown your top or done something stupid and regretted it later? I know I have.
It seems that the hardest thing for people to do is to say "I'm sorry" and yet, that is often the best resolution to a problem.
My preference is to never make a complaint without first trying to resolve the problem every other way possible.
WEAK-AM
Classical Music and More!