a connection question...

I believe the aux send is either bal or unbal. Not really an impedance issue in this case, just one of distance and vulnerability to external interference. As long as you keep the patch lines short (preferably 6' or less) TS cables should be OK.

E.g. on our older Mackie church mixer, I send unbal (TS) from effects (aux 6) to the effects processor, and return it also unbal. The lines are short, right in the console cabinet, and are heavy commercial TS shielded cables. No detectable noise.

HTH ...

I believe the aux send is either bal or unbal.

The manual specifies them as "impedance balanced phono-type output jacks"

The only unbalanced outputs on my mixer are the INSERT I/O and the REC OUT as described previously... thats why I was thinking I needed to output from one of those

As for the Trs jacks.. I'm almost positive the inputs and outputs of the exciter calls for the mono phono plug.. I thought TRS cables were intended only for balanced connects?

Regarding "insert" connection jack, are you familiar with how these are used?

The "insert" jack breaks the audio path to allow inserting some other device in the path. If the insert jack is a channel input insert, it usually breaks the audio path right after the input preamp. A typical use would be to run the channel input directly to a recorder (before EQ, Effects, etc.)and from the recorder back to the channel path.

Other "insert" jacks may be for sub-groups, effects loops, etc.

If you use the "insert" remember that of the three wires, one is the output, one is the return and one is the ground. Refer to your board info for which is which. Normally TIP is the output, RING is the input, SLEEVE is the ground.

If your plan is to use the insert for the output signal without connecting the return path, the signal won't go through to the board main output.

This all assumes there is only one jack for the insert which would be unbalanced connections. Some high-end boards will have separate input and output jacks to allow for balanced insert connections.

I wish I knew exactly which model Aphex Aural Exciter you have. For now, I'll assume it's a vintage '80's model, maybe a B. It's a dual unit. i.e., 2 channels, correct?

The main purpose I had for using it in AUX SEND was so that you could use it on any and/or all channels with AUX SENDS, but ....

I'm going to have to make some further assumptions here, because I don't know for sure what your purpose for it is. 1) You will not be using it for playback of stereo prerecorded sound, such as CDs, tapes, vinyl, iPod, computer line out (playlists), etc., and 2) You will be using it for microphones (your voice) and/or possibly an instrument or mono line input.

If so, you can indeed use the INSERT jacks on ch's 1 and/or 2 of your little mixer, but you will have to buy one or two INSERT CABLES, depending on whether you want to use your Aphex on one or two channels. As MRAM indicated, these are special cables designed to insert the processed signal from, in your case, the Aphex unit, into the path.

With us so far?

OK ... the end of an INSERT CABLE which looks like a stereo phone plug, the TRS end, goes into the mixer channel jack marked "INSERT". Now you have two more wires ... one is marked "TIP" and the other is marked "RING" (don't worry about the sleeve, it's just common ground on all of them).

The wire marked "TIP" goes to the INPUT of one channel of the Aphex unit. Let's assume Aphex channel 1. The other wire marked "RING" goes to the OUTPUT of the same channel (1) of the Aphex unit.

Now the Aphex processor's channel 1 signal is INSERTED into the signal path of the MIXER channel between the Equalizer section and the Fader. Put another way ...

1) The MIC (assuming that's what you have plugged into the MIXER channel) signal is affected first by the Gain and Equalizer sections of the MIXER channel, then ...

2) It goes out to the Aphex where it gets processed, then returns the processed signal back to the MIXER channel, before the Fader, and is now affecting the signal of that MIXER channel when it gets mixed onto the MAINS BUS.

Now the controls on Aphex channel 1 can alter your MIC signal. The Aphex unit controls the output level, the effect (primarily phasing in this unit), and the mix (dry-to-wet), i.e., how much effect is blended with the main signal.

After having gone through this enough to have some sort of handle on what I think (again, not sure) you want to do with it, this seems like the best approach now. The thing is, you will need to purchase an insert cable (or two if you want to to use both channels). Like any cable, be sure it's long enough to reach where you need it to go with no stress and clear of objects, but not excessively long.

NOTE: There is one caveat with your mixer ... there is a warning in the manual that the return section of the INSERT is phase reversed. Not sure why ... maybe to cancel the signal if something is put in backwards. Considering that the Aural Exciter uses phasing to control its effect, I don't know how that will, ummm. how else to say it ... affect the effect.

Ken, Believe it or not,I was actually able to follow your description today, probally since I've been trying better to familiarize with the manual lately.
I was able to follow you every step of the way!
Getting a couple insert cables wouldnt be a problem, since their pretty cheap from what I just checked (I previously thought those were called Y-cables).

Yes, I had read the warning concerning the reverse-phase of the Insert jacks, and actually quoted it in my post above..
But what I'm wondering is what about instead feeding to the exciter from the mixers 'REC OUT'.. using a cable with a rca on one end and a 1/4 on the other.
-And then feeding back from the exciter to the mixers 'RETURN' jack?
It's all an unbalanced flow that way without the worry of reverse-phase problems... but would such a route jive correctly with the mixer?
What do you think?

By the way..
Your correct on your assumptions of the Exciter on all counts; An 80's model B, duel channel.
The closest thing to a manual for the 'B' available is this on pages 1, 5 and 6: http://www.end80radio.com/Aphex_Aural_Exciter_Type_B_and_C.pdf.

The exciters really do a lot for the sound quality on AM in my opinion.. It just crisper and brighter and any muddiness there might have been just goes away.

I intend to use it not just for talk, but also an ample amount of music - I've got a Tascam DP-1 digital recording workstation (not for the air-chain) intended to provide a source of good recordings of the local artist.

So, do you think running out from the REC OUT is feasible, or is the way you described above still the better choice?

-And thanks.

Regarding "insert" connection jack, are you familiar with how these are used?

Mram, I'm not even familiar with how a mixer is used!.. but I did realize it would need a return path.. :}

"So, do you think running out from the REC OUT is feasible, or is the way you described above still the better choice?"

Do NOT use the record-outs to return anything to the mixer, you could get direct feedback on the bus, which will likely cause equipment damage. You don't need to anyway ... the Inserts are all unbalanced, so you'll be fine.

"I intend to use it not just for talk, but also an ample amount of music - I've got a Tascam DP-1 digital recording workstation (not for the air-chain) intended to provide a source of good recordings of the local artist."

The Aphex only has two channels. With the INSERT method, one channel is already in use for your voice mic, so there is no way to playback music in stereo at the same time ... Think about it ... you only have one other channel available, so your music playback would have to have input be mono.

I'll have to study your mixer's oddball AUX sends and returns some more, but right now I don't see a way to use the Aphex with your mixer to do your voice and play back stereo music at the same time. I don't think your mixer has adequate routing for that. Even if you could, you'd likely have to change the Aphex every time you go from voice to recorded music because they're bound to need different settings, at least on one channel, plus be switched.

No stereo involved Ken, I'm using just the left channel of the chain all the way through, nothing is even plugged into the right.
Have a RDL gadgets to combine to a mono feed for any stereo sourced content there might be.
Any music played will either be from a mono source or mixed down before entering the left side of the audio chain.

By the way, this mixer has 4 mic inputs

OMG..
I just realized something. I have two different kinds of RDL audio combiners.
One is the STD Passive Audio Divider/Combiner 10kΩ.( http://www.rdlnet.com/product.php?page=87)

BUT, it's the other one that sounds like a solution to the exciter problem. I got this a while ago, but thought it was just a combiner- I just looked it up again...

RDL TX-LC2 Unbalanced to Balanced Line Combiner:
* Mix 2 Unbalanced Audio Signals to Mono Balanced
* Combine Stereo Into Mono with Balanced Output
* Output Gain Trim
* Isolation Between Inputs
* Unbalanced to Balanced Conversion
* High‑Quality Audio
http://www.rdlnet.com/product.php?page=88

The inputs are rca, and the outputs are screws, but I should be able to splice it all in, right?

I could place it after the exciter and feed direct into the next processor.. I wouldn't have to return to the mixer!

Am I correct in this?

Hmmm ... couple of things, more than one way to skin a cat (ugh! ;))

Why are you only using half the stereo bus of the mixer?

In my case it would make no sense, because of course I stream my signal in stereo to the Internet.

Perhaps it would help if I said how I might use your Aphex Exciter:

In my mixer, I would use one channel of the Exciter as an insert only for my vocal mic channel, because I'd want to work with it until I have my voice how I want it, which would definitely be different than anything else plugged into the console. I could tweak it without affecting other things.

Then I would connect the Effects AUX send to the other Exciter channel, but instead of returning it to an AUX return, I would return it to an unused mixer channel and block off its Effects AUX send (accidentally sending a signal to itself would cause a direct feedback ... very bad things would happen). Now I not only can I play with its level and EQ in a channel fader rather than the unit itself, but I can also adjust any individual channel's wet/dry mix separately, again without touching the unit itself. IOW, I set that Exciter channel's controls for a broad overall sound I like and control the amount of signal it gets from each separate instrument, voice, stereo pair (panned hard Left and hard Right respectively) from a stereo sound source, etc.

See that? Everything has a lot of control, especially my on-air voice. All that would be left, if you did something similar, would be to set a 2-channel compressor/limiter to prevent loud stuff from clipping (and also splashing out of frequency), and a 2-channel graphic EQ (to kill spurious noise harmonics) down stream.

You'd have a great stereo signal to send to the Internet from, say, the Mains out to a digital interface, and maybe the tape-out to your RDA Combiner to your TX. Or however you want to set that up after the chain ... could be the other way 'round, Tape Out -> interface ->computer ( and onto the 'net), mains -> RDA Combiner -> TX ... whatever works best for you.

Hope that made some sense.

Ok.. I kind of follow you.. and believe you know what your talking about when you say that would be the best method with what I have to work with.
But one thing that keeps bothering me is that this means I would have to use the reverse-phased signal output from the mixers INSERT to feed the exciter.. That doesn't have potential of screwing anything up?

I can't help but wonder if I could simplify this whole thing by getting one of those really cheap DI boxes? http://www.provantage.com/pyle-pdc21~7PYLE0R6.htm -

Just wondering

As an insert, the reversed phase thing shouldn't affect the Exciter.If you're concerned, you could query YAMAHA about it.

We have one of those cheapo PYLE DI boxes from years ago, at church. I've never been able to get it to work. If I could have found the receipt. I would have returned it ... I think it's junk. Try a Whirlwind.

But your RDA devices should work ... the only problem being you might have to make your own cable or cut an end off an existing one and strip it to attach to the screw terminals.

That might even be an advantage, though ... What type of line(s) will you run to the Hamilton?

I was suspicious of the Pyle being so cheap when most of them are expensive, otherwise I would have bought it.

50ft of sheilded cable was supplied with the rangemaster.. I cant recall right now if its 4 twisted pair or 8.. It's not the higher quality Beldin, but I assume it will be fine (expecially considering the last time I had a install it inviolved over 100ft of regular telephone line!)

Edit..
But back to the point in question; I wasn't worried the reverse-phase thing would be a problem with the exciter itself, but when used in unision with other proccessing equipment..
As described in manual: "The signal output from the INSERT I/O jacks is reverse-phased. This will not be a problem if connecting the jack to an effector. If using the jack to connect to and external device, however, please be aware of possible phase conflicts with other signals."

I'm checking with Yamaha as to why the output section of the Insert is reverse phase ... I'm curious myself what their reasoning is.