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License Free, legal, low-power radio broadcasting

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More crowding of the FM band

 
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Last Post by Anonymous 10 years ago
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 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
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I don't know what you're planning to include on the technical side, but I'd recommend strongly that you get a copy of the NEC software and model exactly what a transmitter with the power levels you are asking for will do, range-wise.


 
Posted : 07/02/2016 7:39 pm
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

How much is that NEC software and where do you get it?  If its too much, I may not be able to buy it.


 
Posted : 07/02/2016 8:03 pm
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

All I can say is that sometimes you don't know what you need until people create it. Like cell phones or TiVos. Giving people the ability to make community radio may be a good thing. Would it hurt to have the FCC give it a shot for a year and see how it does? Because....LPFM isn't working out so well.


 
Posted : 07/02/2016 9:07 pm
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Technically LPFM was never meant for an individual to set up. It just so happened that because of the loose terminology when it called for a government or city or non profit organization had to apply, it gave a sort of work around for some individuals to apply. What I'm proposing along with my few friends helping with the document is that the stations would be truly individualized stations mostly but not limited towards hobby micro broadcasting. This would not really require the same sort of licensing as a LPFM station would however would not necessarily omit at least letting the FCC know where your site is or having to check with a database to be certain you don't stomp on top of someones contour. Since a 1 Watt signal has a very low 60 dB contour the requirements for operation should not be the same as LPFM. In the document somewhere I'll mention curbing the desire for unauthorized Radio broadcasting as this similar proposal is a reality in countries like New Zealand. We know this won't stop Piracy altogether, but I am sure it will put a dent in the desire or need for it as 1 Watt does have some coverage even with an indoor dipole or circular polarized antenna. That would be 500 mW vertical and 500 mW horizontal. As Bob mentioned 18 Watts was predicted to go 3 miles. So we're talking neighborhood Radio although we know it will most likely go 2-3 miles as Johnny C talks about. The town of Deltaville, VA where I live now is not much more than 4 miles square. So 1 Watt would surely cover Deltaville. Now taking what some folks in Deltaville asked for such as broadcasting Deltaville bands, live events, and interacting with the small community I could do that with 1 Watt FM easily. Mr. Bruce you are a part of this too I'll get a hold of you as you need to see the document to have some input in it. Its really rough now but after the creation is finished it will need some tweaking to look nice and to the point and no bashing uncle Charlie lol. Some of the things my friends didn't like about Jeffery Gill's document was he sort of poked at the FCC and bashed them a bit. That will only make them mad. We don't want that as that is not the reason to make proposals.


 
Posted : 07/02/2016 11:53 pm
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Where are you getting these power to mileage estimates? I can assure you 18 watts will go significantly farther than 2 or 3 miles. Yet 1 watt will struggle with most obstacles and lack useful building penetration, coverage would push maybe 1 mile in a car though.

Then you mentioned polarization... Most operators will not have the space, money, or knowledge to make this work. 


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 3:17 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

I said:  Morse code has been gone for years as a requirement. Being tone deaf has nothing to do with learning to copy code.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 6:37 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Range with FM depends on the receiving equipment, height of the transmitting and receiving antennas, terrain, obstructions, etc.  With the right terrain and receiving equipment, an antenna up high can easily go over a mile with milliwatts.  Our friend in New Zealand operating at 1 watt with their free but licensed service has stated in ALPB meetings that his coverage is several miles to ordinary home receivers, but over 10 miles line of sight with a car receiver.  Of course, in urban jungles with concret buildings, it would likely be a lot less.

If 1 watt ERP is the desired power for a new Part 15 FM service in the U.S., the FCC and the NAB are not going to look at typical ranges, but at the maximums.  I just don't think that that kind of power will fly.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 10:23 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Artisan said: " I just don't think that that kind of power will fly."

I said: That's is the very reason the FCC abandoned the 10 watt LPFM class.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 10:43 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Artisan said: " I just don't think that that kind of power will fly."

I said: That's is the very reason the FCC abandoned the 10 watt LPFM class.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 11:33 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Well, the point too is that the proponents of this kind of power just don't want to be burdened with all the regulatory stuff and reporting that LPFM's at any power would have to endure.

If you don't want to be regulated to that degree (which would certainly give both the FCC and the NAB more peace of mind re interference issues), you have to be prepared to give up something.  In this case, I believe it would be power.  I just don't think that you can directly compare the New Zealand experience to the U.S., as the former just doesn't have the kind of urban sprawl (except maybe in a very few instances) that the latter has.  I kind of think that 25 milliwatts might be the maximum I'd go for, and be ready to accept (very quickly) 5-10 milliwatts, particularly with no antenna restrictions.  As I've stated in the past, I've experimented (very briefly) with those kind of milliwatt power levels and a good vertical antenna mounted up high, and I was able to achieve well over a mile range to a car radio (mind you, on Bowen Island, which is hardly an urban sprawl).


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 11:37 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

As I've posted elsewhere (I think), do your technical homework.  Generate field strength contour maps for the power level you're going for.  Define very precisely 'neighbourhood' - I don't think that an entire town could be classified as a 'neighbourhood', but is it a few blocks, a few square km's, etc.?  Talk about this neighbourhood broadcasting will be different than the services that are available today, including LPFM's, and the advantages.

You're going to have to 'prove' as best you can that there is a demand for this kind of service from people other than yourselves.  That is usually done with surveys and interviews, both with the man (or woman) on the street, as well as existing radio stations.  Illustrate (don't hide) the negatives i.e. concerns of others (including those radio stations), and show how you will mitigate those concerns in the new service.

And that's just for starters.  Good luck.  This will take a lot of effort and time to do properly so that it has a chance of passing.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 11:45 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

I just saw your post about NEC, Legacy.  Surely the consortium can scrape together the money to purchase this software (I believe a license is several hundred dollars).  If you can't do that, then the FCC has the right to ask how you can afford to run a neighbourhood broadcasting station, which will take some $.

But for now, you might be able to ask Rich nicely if he could be involved in this (he has a license) once you make your final decisions as to the power to go for.  However, I'm not even sure that NEC is the right or best software for this - I do know that those contour maps are a prerequisite for licensed stations.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 11:52 am
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

I'm with Artisan on this one. 

Another issue I see involves the EAS and how we would be involved with that. Beyond a certain coverage where the listener totals start getting high, our stations would become responsable for their safety regarding emergency information. At some point there would have to be assurance of cooperation and coordination with the Emergency Alert System.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 12:17 pm
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

That's why I suggested to define 'neighbourhood' very carefully, the smaller it can be the greater liklihood of success.  The focus on programming would be to a particular neighbourhood, such as a small downtown core, or an outlying suburb rather than an entire town or city - that might get you exempted from EAS considerations, as you'll still be way below what the LPFM's are attempting to cover.

To continue along that line, I think an important consideration in any sort of petition is to show where your station leaves off, and others come in.  It would be a very powerful statement to suggest that these new services are not attempting to supplant existing stations, but rather to enhance them, and provide niche services to neighbourhood that the others can't because of their more general nature (and wider coverage).  And then go on to talk about what kinds of services can be provided.  This could have the effect of drawing more people to listen to radio in general, potentially increasing the listenership of ALL stations.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 2:59 pm
 Anonymous
(@Anonymous)
Posts: 0
 

Continuing to hit the nail on the head there Artisan.

Dealing with the gov we have to be extremely careful and thorough in any documentation we send in, just as the big guys do with CPs and other broadcast biz.

I believe a lot of good can come from an enhanced part 15 radio service, we just need to convince everyone else.


 
Posted : 08/02/2016 3:09 pm
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