I was doing some research on 87.9 and realized there's nothing about it where I'd expect it should be.
http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?node=47:1.0.1.1.16
§15.237 Operation in the bands 72.0-73.0 MHz, 74.6-74.8 MHz and 75.2-76.0 MHz.
§15.239 Operation in the band 88-108 MHz.
But then there's this:
The frequency 87.9 MHz, Channel 200, is available only for use of existing Class D stations required to change frequency. It is available only on a noninterference basis with respect to TV Channel 6 stations and adjacent channel noncommercial educational FM stations. It is not available at all within 402 kilometers (250 miles) of Canada and 320 kilometers (199 miles) of Mexico. The specific standards governing its use are contained in §73.512.
So there are no rules for 87.9, channel 6 no longer exists, and no class D licenses anymore (from what I can tell), then why not just allow non-commercial stations to use 87.9?
Even if 87.9 becomes legal would I have to mute the trigger ads from the FM transmitter when they are playing so as to not be commercial? Since I'm simulcasting my Internet station would that be considered? I'd really love to see 87.9 legal for part 15 as it would even make the risk of interference less to commercial stations. I do have a station @ 88.3 which has a spur on 87.5 but 87.9 is nice and clear. We'll have to see rather or not the FCC will ever grant 87.9 to part 15, but you'd think they would since commercial stations don't normally have license to be there however I did see high school stations down there in other locations.
I hate to piss on everyone's corn flakes here. If anything is done with 87.9MHz I am sure the NAB will fight to get it authorized for their full powered counterparts, whether they be displaced FM stations or Am stations looking to go FM in tight markets where channel availability is non-existent.
In all the hype I hear here on this site about 87.9MHz I have not seen one mention of 87.9MHz at the FCC Daily Digests. That means our words spoken here at this site are NOT being heard by those that need to hear them that would be Congress and those at the FCC who can consider a change.
If 87.9MHz was publicly announced as being part of a new part 15 FM transmitter frequency, it would not take long before that ONE channel becomes congested with traffic. One of the biggest issues with 87.9MHz is it's location to VHF television channel 6. The audio frequency for this channel is 87.5MHz. It is without a doubt, that when the re-packing of the existing UHF broadcast band takes place, channels 2 through 13 will be used again for the displaced stations that were transmitting above channel 37. In fact some television stations have already moved off of channels that were above channel 47, as more stations move to a lower channel, there will be no choice but to either share a channel or move back into the VHF low television band.
The FCC will view any part 15 on 87.9MHz as potential interference to neighboring homes who rely on a television antenna for television services. Last I knew, in New Haven, Ct. WEDY used VHF television 6, I heard they wanted to move to channel 41, but data does not confirm if that change was made. Also there are still television stations operating on VHF channel 6 across the USA.
I know we talk about 87.9MHz a lot here, but seriously guys, our words are stuck here and not getting out to the right people who can lobby for change. Part 15 is stuck at being a legal toy for in home private consumer use and was never looked at being a broadcast industry service. It is us who have made it into such by deciding to provide entertainment geared at those outside our personal homes. We made part 15 a broadcast service, not the FCC, nor did they ever intend it to be a broadcast service.
Part 15 goes as far back as those rabbit devices that allowed you to receive your television reception wirelessly through out your home, one area of your home had the transmitter, the other end the receiver that attached to the intended television set. Also wireless intercoms and cordless telephones and wireless routers were part of part 15. So as you can see, most part 15 devices were developed with the intension's of being a private wireless device, not a broadcast service.
Their idea of part 15 and our idea of part 15 are two totally different things.
I don't know about the rest of you here, but I check out the FCC Daily Digests site every chance I can get and I try to keep up with what changes are being considered or what changes they have made. I just do not ever see anything you are all hoping to hear about the FM broadcast band. It appears the NAB has anything you'd like to hear blocked from ever happening.
Bruce.
87.7 must also be included in all the talk about getting the lower frequencies open for use. I want 87.7.
Here in the midwaste we have a full power 88.1 which a lot of part 15ers would envy because all it has is homemade DJs with their record collections. I don't listen to it because my record collection is better.
My Scocshe FM transmitter is certified for 87.7 & 87.9, but people tell me that certification is useless.
The only FM station licensed to operate on 87.9 is KSFH, 10 Watts, Mountain View, California, operated by a high school. But the station is being sold and its frequency possibly being moved:
I agree with some of what Bruce says because I know our channel 43 here may want to move to a channel between 2-6. It could Jam FM. The AM stations wanting to play music will want the first dibs on 87.9 if it does come available. As far as intent of micro broadcasting and rather its intent is muddy. We talked about the Wild Planet DJ and the Remco that was sold as a Mini Radio station which I think started the low powed Radio station idea. Yes we talked about getting this other Radio group to help either set up an affordable or Free or just above it for people to use. New Zealand should be the example here. FM certainly won't be available in all areas so those who want to try AM the Talking House is a good transmitter to see if we can make work. We need too to see how the AM petition goes too. Somehow we need our voice heard. Just as there may be anti low power trolls who read this im sure some may pass what we say to the FCC. We also need a good spokesperson to be on our side of the fence.
I read two things in this thread I wanted to correct.
@post 1: CH6 is alive. For example, the ABC station in Philadelphia transmits full power DTV on VHF channel 6, 82-88MHz. Right now, there are 8 full power DTV stations licensed in the country. That aside, there are many LP digital and analog stations.
@post 3: The audio for analog TV channel 6 is on 87.75MHz.
That being said:
In my opinion, the FM radio band is not going to get bigger. For the FM radio band to get bigger someone with piles of money would need to want to make it bigger (that is an indicator of the sad state of the FCC). The people with the piles of money are Verizon and AT&T. They want UHF spectrum. Right now, TV is in the UHF spectrum. TV can be operated in the VHF spectrum, so Verizon and AT&T dollars are going to be used to move UHF users into VHF space (that is an oversimplification, but it is close enough to illustrate my point.) Most AM stations are either broke, or being kept afloat by an FM sister station; they do not have Verizon or AT&T type money to make the FCC want to turn CH5 or CH6 into an expanded FM band. The FM stations have money, but not Verizon or AT&T type money, and an expanded FM band would mean more competition for them. And look at receivers. Cell phones get replaced every few years, so new spectrum for them will get incorporated into the transceivers chips fairly quickly. Radios do not get replaced often. Even if there was an expanded FM band, the stations below 88.1 (or 87.9, or 87.7, or the rare 87.5) would be at a disadvantage for reception which may make them less commercially viable.
I have discussed 87.9/87.7 to death in other threads. Click on my name next to this post, then look at my other posts, and there is a wealth of information.
Forgot the Audio for ch6 was 87.75 and that some are still using that channel. Hence I can see why transmitting down there is illegal. Yes that does make it quite clear that we'll never get that frequency for part 15. I'd say that idea you may as well flush that one and go on to the next important thing about this proposal we are talking and working on. If you have no other frequency in your area I hate to say it because I'm not a fan of AM, but that would be where you need to go. And the Talking House (also iAM) is an affordable and easy TX to experiment with and try and improve the range. Station8 has been working his tail off on trying to get some of the shortcomings worked out with his Talking House TX. Now for those of us who have blank frequencies in our area it just means we have to go off air after 6PM during temperature inversions and be sure a distant station is not starting to come in. If so it means your hours of operation will be short during those days.
Geese I just finally looked back into this thread and caught a BIG booboo I made in post number 3, I stated that channel 6 audio was on 87.5MHz, that was a typo I did not catch until now, so I just wanted make a correction here that that was supposed to say 87.7MHz not 87.5MHz.
Guys and Galls, I am sitting here and trying to find a possible alternative we could go after for a new VLPFM radio service for hobbyists.
I was looking at a website I go to related to AM stereo. I do not how recent those articles are, but mention was made that AMAX would be the new AM stereo standard.
As you know I have a C-Quam AM Stereo Transmitter. Read this page and scroll down to "Is There Any Hope?" section and read that.
http://users.hfx.eastlink.ca/~amstereo/amstereo.htm
If I am not mistaken, C-Quam and the AMAX are two entirely different stereo formats.
I'd hate to go C-Quam, if AMAX is where AM is headed for AM Stereo.
If I ever go back on the air again, I'd like to broadcast on the AM broadcast band in STEREO.
I believe being a stereo station on AM may help revitalize the AM broadcast band.
Thoughts?
Bruce.
My parents has an Oldsmobile that had a car Stereo with FM and AM Stereo. It had a button you could press for AM stereo. I think it used C-Quam for Stereo. Id stick with that for now. People in cars can hear Stereo and could get you AM listeners.
AMAX was a set of features for radios. An AMAX AM radio would, in theory, get the best possible audio from an AM station.