- February 17, 2019 at 9:11 am #109615
Occasionally I go over to the ALPB Forum to see what is happening. Usually not much.
It now appears that the ALPB is effectively disbanding. It’s been in limbo since the Chairman passed away. Something was said about continuing social meetings, but whether that would be under the banner of the organization is still questionable. The existing Forum is staying, being renamed (to something surrounding Micro Broadcasting), and presumably the ALPB Business boards are being removed.
I feel somewhat conflicted about all of this. Sad, because the group held so much promise, but was torn apart with petty politics and a power grab (having an unhealthy Chairman who wasn’t able to participate a lot and make decisions didn’t help). Happy, to see something at least continue on. Cautiously optimistic, that the new Forum can be a different voice in the world of Part 15, and not just an echo of the existing Forums (including this one).
I guess we’ll just have to wait and see how it all plays out.
- February 17, 2019 at 11:08 am #109631
Speaking from the camp that wants to see the Part 15 hobby survive and grow I also have been disturbed by recent behavior at the ALPB.
The power grab referred to took place at the exact time when Jim Henry was undergoing critical surgery, making the act especially ugsome.
The thread regarding the renaming of the surviving forum is put in the form of a contest but without a vote among members.
The self-claimed “admin” did not, so far as one can glean from the thread, call a vote to democratize his appointment.
What appears to be forming is another “hobbybroadcaster” under a tyrant coupled with a replica of part15.org, putting itself in direct competition with this forum.
The small cadre of remaining members seem unaware they are being hijacked.
- February 17, 2019 at 11:22 am #109632
That’s not the impression I get. From what I understand the ALPB remains with a focus on it’s original intentions, but is separating itself from the forum and to do that it is simply renaming the forum to something like ‘Micro Broadcasters Community Forum’ (or something similar) and allowing it to stand on it’s own without affiliation to the ALPB.
Basically, the ALPB is doing away with being connected to a forum, but not eliminating anything which is existing.
- February 17, 2019 at 12:36 pm #109633
OK I’ve got a gripe about why the ALPB is failing!! NO Tyrant ever Ran the ALPB unless you’re calling Bob a Tyrant? Bob has always given his fair share of time to part 15 and Tyrant, Dictator, King or whatever you want to call him is surely not correct.
The ALPB’s forum is FAR from what HobbyBroadcaster.net does its links are open season and your not judged before you have a membership there. Some tried to say The Initiative was such a place too but even that is far from the truth as all of our links are FREE to view except the petition (which is only for the Ride-Or Die folks who want something other than Yeardcasting on a dying broadcast band called Medium Wave (Called AM Radio by the lame non tech folks).
The part 15 hobby has become a narc fest whereas if you don’t like someone’s station you’ll try and take them down for running an ASMAX2 kit transmitter. Yes I was visited by the FCC AGAIN (Hey I hope they like my Album Rock Station) but this time they looked at my antenna, took spectrum readings (my Wife saw it and asked me “Troy who are you interfering with now)? and before I could even meet the agents to ask about my Transmitter’s performance on the analyzer they were Gone. I’ve no doubt it was a narc who didn’t like I was broadcasting in C-Quam AM Stereo as I advertise C-Quam AM Stereo WAQM The Legacy Deltaville, VA Some get jealous it just means The Legacy is a great station as the FCC didn’t have any problems with it nor will they ever because I have a broadcast engineer who knows his stuff and won’t allow my station to cause harmful interference to a legal licensed station, 160 meter Ham Radio, or Short Wave. So whatever issue someone has with The Legacy they need to chill out. I don’t have any FM transmitters anymore nor will I go on FM its too bloody crowded and too easy to interfere with other bands that could cause harm to Aircraft, Fire, Public Safety.
Its suppose to be a Hobby but its a cut throat take out the competition if their better than you or maybe get out 1 1/4-2 miles The FCC said I could and that is what the station shoots for on a Good Radio like a Tecsum, Grundig, Sangean or Car Radio. That 2 miles is NO THREAT to anyone. All The Legacy wants to do is get Good Album Rock out to the masses.
By The Way Hobby Broadcaster Does have some Good Invormation on it, but due to some animosity they may have towards me I doubt I’ll get in. I had a membership but list my pass and my New IP provider Email address is not the same as my old Century Link one. But I’m probably labeled over their as some sort of nut job or worse.
Part 15 (dot) org has had numerous issues with its software and so there are two other micro broadcasting sites now. The Initiative (My Site), The ALPB soon to be changed forum. Both forums don’t lock folks out and don’t act like tyrants and both treat its members with respect. Not saying Part 15 (dot) org is a bad place but for some reason some may think we’re trying to steal their thunder. Its another micro broadcasting forum that is it.
Sorry I went in a tirade but I’m sick of all the petty bickering on these sites and I don’t appreciate Bob Falmly being called a tyrant. He is one of the most easy going people I’ve met and I sure wish I had a chance to work at WCFI and do an Album Rock show their. I’m sure he’d let me if I were close to him.
Now I’ll return you to your regular scheduled gossip.
- February 17, 2019 at 2:34 pm #109634
Thelegacy, you really have no idea what you are talking about.
You’ve never been involved in the running of the ALPB – I have, first as Forum Moderator and then Chairman when Bob walked away from the position.
You weren’t involved in the behind-the-scenes machinations when Bob came back and decided that he didn’t like what was being posted in the ALPB Forums – I was, as somehow he (and a few others) still thought that I was a Moderator (I resigned when Jim Henry was elected Chairman). And my advice was solicited by yet others who felt they were under attack.
As a Forum Moderator here, I stopped the in-fighting from spreading to Part15.us, and saw another, non-public side of the situation in the form of several rather nasty, private, e-mails.
The existing Part 15 Forums serve different types of individuals, with different types of needs. If you don’t like one, you are more than welcome not to participate in it. I’ve certainly chosen where I lay my hat.
However, I never intended this to become a name calling thread. So let’s keep it on topic.
RichPowers, the ALPB seems a rather grandiose name for several people meeting informally once or twice a month over Teamspeak. That’s one of the reasons that an attempt was made to expand the use of the ALPB Forum – to involve more people in decision making, as the organization was always intended to be a full democracy, with each member having an equal say (although that intent appears to have fallen by the wayside).
Separating the Forum from the meetings (which I personally felt were mostly a waste of time anyway) just takes the group back to what Bill DeFelice once described as a “coffee klatch”. I agree with him on that. Not that there’s anything wrong with coffee klatches. I just don’t think that that was, or remains, the objective of the ALPB.
I brought the topic up because I really don’t want to see the circle of Part 15 broadcasters, organizations and web-sites shrink further than it has in the past several years. Maybe there are plans to greatly expand the ALPB membership, but focusing primarily on meetings as a group vehicle is always going to be self limiting (you can only pack so many people into a meeting and be effective – that’s just Management 101).
- This reply was modified 1 month ago by ArtisanRadio.
- February 17, 2019 at 4:27 pm #109636
I thought it was just changing it’s name to and was interested in feedback about new names.
I and a few others gave some suggestions but nothing was mentioned about shutting down. I wouldn’t like to see it close as it would be missed.
- This reply was modified 1 month ago by Mark.
- February 17, 2019 at 4:56 pm #109638
@ thelegacy….If you got another visit it wasn’t necessarily because someone reported you for something it was because you are on their radar as you were visited once. So follow up checks may happen. Be good with them and they will be good with you.
You are too quick to assume someone is a “narc” and that’s why you got a visit.
Also they didn’t say you can’t go on FM, they just said don’t cause interference. They even recommended the Decade. Maybe you won’t get any more visits and you know that no one will complain of interference on AM as it’s normal and expected on AM as I’ve said before but don’t assume you got a visit because of a “narc”…..you got a visit because your 7 watt Chinese transmitter was wiping out someone else’s radio…..could have been someone down the street, and you were all over the map with interference.
And the only reason for the most recent visit was a follow up.
- February 17, 2019 at 5:38 pm #109639
Impression Over Witness
First hand observations of what transpired in the takeover of the ALPB are swept aside by Rich Powers proclaiming: “That’s not the impression I get.”
And, as we’ve now heard from the remaining three “associates” who express no displeasure with changes being made, perhaps I’ll join the “impression” and wish everyone well.
We’ll call it the radio version of the movie “Lord of the Flies” and keep a lookout for FCC agents in the garden.
- February 17, 2019 at 8:45 pm #109645
I have no animosity towards the FCC at least I’ll stop having bad dreams about my transmitter wiping out everything. I still do frequent checks as well as monthly checks from my engineer friend. The fact the FCC did not find my equipment faulty is a good thing but I won’t get lazy I’ll still do routine checks.
- February 17, 2019 at 9:12 pm #109646
I think the good thing about the ALPB is the forum as Artisan has informed is staying with a new name, even though there will be no ALPB or if there is it will be a separate from the forum. Micro Broadcasters is a good name and accurate of unlicensed broadcasting.
- February 19, 2019 at 12:57 pm #109663
I just re-read every comment in this thread and see no explanation of the original questions.
1.) Why does the ALPB need to be split apart into separate components? The combining of the resources made better sense. Most members never attended meetings but could participate in the forum.
2.) Will the Teamspeak Meeting part of the organization continue to function? If not, who is actually deciding. It looks like the self-appointed admin has done away with the democratic voting of membership to make decisions and places his judgements above everyone.
3.) Thoughtless support has been given to the simple fact of having more part 15 forums, but a little thought will realize that diluting the field with more forums weakens every forum because the few hobbyists will be spread around. More than that, the renamed “micro” forum will be a blend of this website and hobbybroadcaster, all rolled into one. There will be nothing new or unique about it.
Along with most of you, I strongly believe in this hobby but I see it breaking up into fragments and splinters.
- February 19, 2019 at 1:50 pm #109664
I’ll answer that with some armchair speculation, and based on the way I understand it.
1. As said previously, apparently the forum veered from the actual original objectives of the ALPB (to be honest I never was really clear about what those objectives actually were). Since the forum views did not correspond with the ALPBs mission the natural remedy was to separate the two into two separate entities and allow both venues to continue along it’s merry way.
2. It is my understanding based on the comments concerning the matter that the Team Speak meeting will continue and will be the primary medium used for the ALPB meetings.
3. I’m unsure how to respond to your third question/point, because I completely disagree that an additional forum dilutes the prior, for one thing it is not another forum being added, it already existed but is only changing the name. I’ve heard the same type arguments made about a new restaurant being opened in the neighborhood, because it’s going to decrease people eating in the existing ones.. but in reality that’s not what happens, the more selections results on a higher overall popularity.. people are always going to have their favorite hangouts, but they are going to move around and participate elsewhere just the same.
It’s never better to have only one spot to congregate, it can actually lead to stagnation.
- February 19, 2019 at 2:05 pm #109665
Oh, one other thong..
I’ve seen a few announcements come an go about a scheduled Team Speak meeting and no one attended.. Myself, I never was much of a participant, I think I attended one a few years ago, but the point is the announcements were made but no one bothered to participate. Also request were made on the forum to vote, again only a couple bothered to give a response.. So, it seems the complaint about decisions being made without a vote is unwarranted.. no?
- February 19, 2019 at 2:34 pm #109666
Thank you Rich Powers for the background information.
On this remark I have more to say: “Also request were made on the forum to vote, again only a couple bothered to give a response.. So, it seems the complaint about decisions being made without a vote is unwarranted.. no?”
In a democratic system if voters don’t make a suitable turnout is not a reason to discontinue democracy. It doesn’t give the vote-counter the right to name himself a dictator.
Then there’s this: those who don’t participate in their democracy deserve what they get.
- February 19, 2019 at 4:44 pm #109667
I can also answer some of Rich’s questions, and respond to his comments about ALPB member participation.
I was one of the original members of the ALPB (not original original, but joined a few months in) and stayed until mid last year. That was for a period of multiple years.
The ALPB meetings were always sparsely attended, with a few staunch regulars, and a few dropping in and out. Probably an average of 5, sometimes a few more, sometimes less. I found that if there were any more than 5, the meeting topics wandered, and little was accomplished. My opinion anyway.
It was always a question why so few attended the meetings, although many stated the usual – at an awkward time, had other things to do, etc. I also suspect that some felt like me – they didn’t like meetings and felt that they were largely a waste of time. That’s why an attempt was made to incorporate the Forum into ALPB decision-making. Utilizing the vote mechanism of the Forum did make a difference, and there was often double digit participation. So, relatively, a success, although of course better results were hoped for. It has to be remembered that even now, the number of registered members (via the Forum) is only 100, and that includes some duplicates, as well as many dropouts. Usually, an active participation rate in any Forum of 5-10% is good, so take that for what you will.
I personally am disappointed that the ALPB never managed to grow more than it has.
I’m also disappointed in the political in-fighting that occurred, as well as the power play that was enacted and the apparent disregard for the ALPB charter. I’m not surprised that few people are participating after that fiasco – it all left a rather bad taste in the mouth, and the group lost some of its most active members and most prolific posters. Contrary to what was said in an earlier post, I wouldn’t hold my breath about those same people drifting back. Remember the saying – fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me.
That being said, I wish what remains of the group well.
- February 19, 2019 at 4:47 pm #109668
Besides the 3 hobby radio forums there’s also the 2 on Facebook.
I don’t think the Admin. of the ALPB is acting as dictator as he’s asking for member input on a name and even the separating of the forum and the ALPB. In fact the new name is the result of input from the few members including myself.
I think only 3 people, myself included, bothered to even give an opinion that was asked for. I disagree with Carl as he said that if no voters turn out as in the case of the ALPB when input is asked for the answer shouldn’t be a dictatorship, but what else can you get?
Democracy depends on participation, no participation = dictatorship as then someone just makes the decisions as no one cares anyway.
- February 19, 2019 at 11:59 pm #109671
Good Point Mark. The ALPB’s Non Activist stance has always been its self made failure in the first place in my opinion.
As time seems to go on fewer and fewer people give a Rat’s Fanny what the group does as its pretty much been a social round table talk club and that alone in my opinion.
Jim Henry like myself did state at one point in order to get recognized the ALPB would eventually have to do something more activist related. We had a chance for a Huge Make It or Break It opportunity offered by A-Train which included getting our name recognized World Wide. This happened on 2/17/18 on our Teamspeak meeting I remember it quite well.
A-Train, Myself, and even Bob was interested in this amazing opportunity. But if memory serves me well the subject of Alan Wiener and Brother Stare come up. A-Train as myself didn’t want to associate ourselves with a station that allowed a known child molester on air. Carl Blair said in a stern non exception voice that the ALPB allowed folks to talk about Pirate Radio in his disgust against A-Train’s decision to try and find a Radio Station that didn’t associate itself with known unexceptionable acts A differrent Shortwave station was also discussed but few showed any real interest in donations towards this effort. So the idea was totally scrapped as Bob, Myself, Anthony, Station8 were the only ones who considered actually paying for such a show. Funny how all but one or two members who wanted to do something were also New Radio Revolution activists ready to make a better way for this hobby. Sad indeed as this could have got our voice to the FCC about how Hobby Broadcasting matters and could helped pave the way towards The New Radio Revolution’s petition for a separate service for Micro Broadcasting.
Again the ALPB had already set itself to fail at that point in my opinion but this was not the fault of Bob. He wanted this I could tell it. So the wheels of time grind away and an opportunity like that will never knock twice. A situation of defecate or get off the pot. Some rather sit on the pot till they get hemorrhoids. (Sorry Bob I kike you a lot but that is how I feel about the ALPB and why its seen its better days) Social gatherings are good don’t get me wrong.
I’ll still socialize with Johnny C, Bob, and those who want to have a good time talking about Micro Broadcasting on Teamspeak. But for the last few months we’ve had little participation and I have even tried to start a phone chat room FREE on the New Radio Revolution’s site with no real interest so I left it alone.
For many reasons I do see the hobby slowly rotting and falling and fragmenting. You have one forum which in my opinion copied The New Radio Revolutions Elite Board idea out of context to try and show they are Elite. And fear of rouge agents who have an agenda to infiltrate the community for some corporate broadcasting benefit. It is quite clear this hobby has some very hostile water lurking deep within. we’ll watch cautiously from now on as we don’t want to be swept into an evil place. I just have this awful gut feeling and my spirit guides tell me to watch out. I believe in metaphysics, practice it and believe in it and they tell me to Watch Out a hostile enemy lurks.
- February 20, 2019 at 2:57 am #109672
I have no idea what you’re talking about, but as for the re-named forum.. I find it alarming the announcement of a policy being applied that regulatory issues are not to be discussed in the forum.
This strongly implies it is to be a pirate forum.. which is fine if that’s the intention, but the problem is that the name “micro broadcaster community” is commonly associated with part 15 or other legal unlicensed broadcasting, and to give a pirate tolerant forum that name implies a direct association between the two.
The forum name should reflect what it is.. “Micro-Broadcaster” is generally established as a synonym of part 15.. for a pirate tolerant forum to take that name is not only problematic, but deceptive.
I’m a bit concerned about it.
- February 20, 2019 at 9:40 am #109675
The ALPB is NOT!!!!! Planning to be Pirate!!!!! They only allowed Freedom Of Speech. The New Radio Revolution does allow some talk of in only in Elite Section of the board but Does caution those who FM Pirate. I’ve KILLED most FM Pirate talk on The Initiative due to the interference issues with Pirate FM!!!!!
The ALPB has ALWAYS allowed Freedom Of expression while reminding others they are not a Pirate site. There are plenty of those already but some are very misguided and think you can use a cheap Chines Transmitter. Some require you to have a Veronica, Broadcast Wharehouse, or AM transmitter of good value. Pirates have always called it Micro Broadcasting. Every Pirate site I’ve ever went to has. The call part 15 pee pee power, yardcaster, or neighbor caster. Some don’t hate part 15 some call it Toy Town. Just some FYI about Pirate Boards, sites. I’ve known them since the BBS days and Commodore 64 days. There were plenty in Michigan.
The ALPB has always encouraged respect to the FCC and respect to the airwaves due to it is a finite resource that should not be trampled by mega watt junkies who don’t care who their jamming. At the same time some of us want to try and change the rules within reason. Myself included in that one. However we want to have a separate microbroadcasting service for citizens to broadcast with a 40 dbuV signal for 2 miles to a Tecsun PL-380 or similar Radio with a dbuV meter.
We are NOT Pirates at the ALPB. Very few (if any) discussions reflect Pirate Radio but too Pirate RAdio at least FM Pirate Radio is due to the ignorance of C-Quam AM Stereo. Once that is brought back there will be Less Pirates on FM. That is why The New Radio Revolution along side of Greg Bushwald of Motorola is going to try and mandate a portion of the AM band C-Quam AM Stereo ONLY!!!!! in order to entice safe broadcasting and a less hostile Radio environment. Hope this helps.
The Legacy C-Quam AM Stereo 1640, Deltaville, VA.
- February 20, 2019 at 10:40 am #109676
Choosing a Leader
The greatest weakness at the ALPB has been shortage of competent leadership.
From among today’s members my pick for logical leader of the ALPB is Rich Powers.
No one has cared so much for the hobby as Rich Powers.
Just look at his beautifully prepared Part 15 Lab
Check out his carefully researched history of T.I.S. radio, which grows out of part 15 beginnings.
As of today I am the Campaign Chairman of the Elect Rich Powers Committee for ALPB Leader.
Sign up today and promote Rich Powers.
- February 20, 2019 at 12:16 pm #109678
I have no interest in being the leader of the ALPB, nor do I posses the technical knowledge such a position would require.
As for “pee pee power” vs “new radio revolution” or whatever.. My interest lies in enjoying a hobby which is legal and being involved in discussions in that respect. As for CQuam saving AM that seems such a ridiculous notion to me, that I have no interest in it. But we are all free to believe and pursue what compels us.
I’m compelled for my own pursuits to be within the realms of legality, and am not particularly keen about partaking or discussing methods or practices of defying it.
- February 20, 2019 at 1:04 pm #109679
Total posts : 69
Troy, I’m curious. Your website includes the claim that, “We will soon have a coverage of 1.5-2 miles in all directions from Fishing Bay Road.”
Ground conductivity out in Reedville VA has to be stunning, given how damp the land is at all times (everybody else, Google-Map it). But otherwise, technically, how do you accomplish a two-mile contour and still remain legal?
- February 20, 2019 at 1:06 pm #109680
Total posts : 69
Sorry, Deltaville. I had my map reader in the wrong town.
- February 20, 2019 at 2:41 pm #109681
<b>As the agent said it is feasible to cover 1.5-2 miles (So too says Rangemaster).</b>
No where in the rules says your antenna has to be a Vertical antenna. Check Out Red Horse’s coil antenna with HIGH GAIN!! The antenna reaches 3 miles to a Car Radio and 2 miles EVERYDAY to a Tecsun Radio. We do reach 2 miles to a Kenwood car stereo. So that in and of itself makes it possible to get the range we want. Another Good antenna is the antennas used by Hams who lived in small apartments and some of those were way less than 10 feet for 160 meter Ham. 160 meters is Close to AM in fact an Isotron Antenna could work or 160 meter mobile antenna with its coil changed to a different coil.
My engineer knows his stuff we could even go Carrier Current if needed as Deltaville does have bypass caps on its distrobution system. Can you say Cable AM Radio? Plug your Radio in and instantly you’ll hear The Legacy if you tune to 1640 Khz in Deltaville, VA.
Renting Land to erect a 50-100 Ft tower 1/2 a mile away from the Deltaville Market. Now our signal gets to the market to a Tecsun PL-380 @ 18-19 dbuV The idea is to have it fade up to the second C-Quam AM Stereo transmitter once the first one fades. I’m actually looking into doing exactly what a dude that gets 5 miles legally with his Rangemaster and NO GROUND and see if I can put the transmitter inside the steeple in exchange for some Album Oriented Christian Rock and the minister broadcasting his Gospel on Sunday to the congregation of Deltaville, VA. Remember Tim in Bovey gets 1 1/4 miles to a pocket Radio (Pocket Radio probably not as good as a Tecsun). He breaks NO LAWS. And has CLEARLY stated this on the Facebook Hobby AM&FM broadcasting page. We are aiming for that market with an Album Rock Quality Signal!
I think a few hours a week in exchange for a good Album Rock station in this town is worth it. I already play Saint, Neal Morse, Resurrection Band, Messiah Prophet, Stryper so as I told him it won’t break Album Rock programming and Deltaville would have a Nice station whereas the Internet stream would be picked up via a Smartphone and rebroadcast to the transmitter via the Sean Cuthbert audio processor to keep Album Rock high standards for audio and have 100% modulation.
Long Live Rock, Long Live those who donate to The Legacy and long live the true goal.
- February 20, 2019 at 3:07 pm #109682
Rich Powers, I understand your reluctance to take charge of the ALPB but this statement confuses me: “…nor do I posses the technical knowledge such a position would require.”
The only skill needed are the talents you already have. Things like the Teamspeak Server can be provided by someone like Part15Engineer who in fact supplied the Teamspeak Service during Jim Henry’s chairmanship.
That brings up the question why Part15Engineer had his server closed down by the Hostile Takeover and his position as Moderator revoked?
By natural succession Part15Engineer should have ascended to the Chairmanship as next-in-line following Jim Henry’s death.
- February 20, 2019 at 4:30 pm #109684
Carl, really I really have not the slightest inkling interest in taking charge, and don’t even get why you would be suggesting me, there are plenty who would be more suitable.
On the other matter.. it really goes without saying that there is no such thing as getting 5 miles legally with a Rangemaster, but you can certainly exceed even that with an unlegal install of a Rangemaster or Procaster…. As for the NO GROUND claim, again it goes without saying just because you don’t have a ground wire attached to the ground leas doesn’t mean you have NO GROUND. It well known that the ground path is simply taking another route through the power or audio cabling, so the antenna system is still drastically exceeding 3 meters.
- February 20, 2019 at 6:35 pm #109686
The hostile trying to lock Bob out of his own site ended any chance for that.
If it were not for that act in and of itself technical issues rose when Teamspeak changed its protocol. Bob had the compatibility to work with the new Android app.
All things considered the hostile acts performed by a kou of few killed the ALPB which was an open opportunity orchestrated well meditated evil plan that ruined the group probably forever.
- February 20, 2019 at 8:02 pm #109688
Time for Your Medicine
TheLegacy has the magic of always being wrongly informed: “The hostile trying to lock Bob out of his own site ended any chance for that.”
A.) No such thing ever happened. No one tried to lock Bob out of the website;
B.) It was never “Bob’s website”. The ALPB was owned by its members and most of them STILL don’t know what actually happened, and the stories Bob is telling don’t contain that information, to put it mildly.
But we’re not holding a trial here, although the members could gather and find that Bob has been detrimental to the ALPB as outlined in the Charter and expel him based on the procedures that are outlined. If called to testify I will swear an oath and tell what I witnessed.
It is plain stupid to say that a plan was “meditated and orchestrated”.
We’re thinking of taking up a collection to send you for an education.
- This reply was modified 4 weeks, 1 day ago by Carl Blare.
- February 20, 2019 at 8:26 pm #109690
Thelegacy’s post is just plain wrong, and goes over the line of ad hominem attacks. I was going to Unapprove it (and in fact, did for a little while). Then I saw Carl’s rebuttal, which is by and large accurate and factual. However, it made no sense without the original post being there. So the offending post is back.
I think that it is time to lock this thread. It’s gotten way off topic, and I don’t think that any further purpose will be achieved by letting it go on.
The topic ‘The ALPB Going Away?’ is closed to new replies.