- October 15, 2019 at 12:57 pm #113116
More roumers of organizations and unlicensed stations on this so-called White space area.
Part 15 section 236 has been brought up before and I hate to keep bringing this up but I can’t seem to find any certified transmitters that broadcast on 87.5 Mhz and this brings up this question as the red flag was raised in my mind.
Last time I tried to find a device I found the ONN headphone transmitter/headphone set and the transmitter was not a full 50 mW output as well as a cheaply made transmitter headphone system.
Now at a stadium the range would have to be at least 300 Ft to reach one end to the other in a football stadium. This in mind if true under part 15 section 236 should yield as good as or better than Bets-1 in Canada where as the Decade MS-100 Canadian BETS-1 version has a max 1mW output.
To try and research this more I’d like to know if anyone knows what football stadium used this transmitter? What is the make and model of the Transmitter and is the transmitter claiming or possesses a label or etching on it with an FCC ID code that actually is in their database as a valid certification rather than some false certification claim that we’ve seen too often with some dishonest transmitter manufacturers?
If anyone knows of the answer to these questions it will help me research this further as we could use this information to either pass this as truth or disregard it as false information once again.
- October 15, 2019 at 4:36 pm #113120
I presume your referring to the Green Bay Packers part 15 system I had posted about a few months ago which is used to provide play by play broadcast within their stadium for spectators without the delay experienced from a network feed received on a standard portable radio. Numerous other professional sports arenas use this method as well (Baseball, Basketball, Soccer, ect.).
But it’s not on 87.5, it’s on a selected frequency below it..
Wiki describes the system as such: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Packers_Radio_Network
“..Both feeds are on non-standard FM frequencies below 87.5 FM MHz which require purchase of a special radio tuner from the team’s pro shop to listen to that signal clearly..”
- October 15, 2019 at 5:19 pm #113122
However, let me also point out the wiki article may be incorrect (or at least outdated) when it says “Two internal Part 15 radio stations are operated within the area surrounding Lambeau Field during Packers home games..”
I had dug around looking for conformation about this a few months ago, and found numerous articles and documentation concerning it, but best that I have been able to determine they are not part 15.. Although they appear in some ways to conform to part 15 rules, the supplier (Live Sports Radio) have requested and been granted numerous SPECIAL TEMPORARY AUTHORITY over the last decade or so. The Packers spent $10,000 for transmitters and antennas in the stadium, not counting the many thousands of receivers purchased at $7.50 each, which they resell for about $20 to spectators. The most recent info I’ve come across (2016) is that they use a PTEK FM audio transmitter, and vertical flexible whip antenna AD-44 design omni-directional.
So in conclusion, I suspect originally they operated under part 15 as Wiki reports, but as the supplier (Live Sports Radio) grew STA’s became a requirement.
- October 15, 2019 at 8:14 pm #113128
If these radios are about $20 each and someone gets tickets to the game and buys the radio maybe we can find out what frequency the transmitter is on. Maybe they use the same frequency as the ONN headphone transmitter. I’ll look up Ptek FM transmitter. It may be a loophole I’m looking for.
- October 15, 2019 at 8:32 pm #113130
Total posts : 492
Seems as I thought, maybe, and I say maybe, there may be some permit that can be had similar to Canada’s RSS-123 for special “events” and they got a permit to have this certain frequency and special receivers as allowed. Maybe Wikipedia made the mistake of it being part 15 as isn’t part 15 dealing with unlicensed services? Drive ins could also probably use this service too. Whatever, the company Live Sports Radio, I’m sure got the permit for this from the FCC and I’m sure this service is available somewhere in the rules but it may not be part 15. Maybe white space can be used for special temporary “events” and a permit can be had if applied for and approved.
Wonder what frequency it was on and what receivers was the stadium selling to the spectators.
- This reply was modified 4 weeks, 1 day ago by Mark.
- October 15, 2019 at 8:36 pm #113132
- October 15, 2019 at 10:11 pm #113136
I saw one of the Green Bay Packer radios on eBay but forgot what frequency it used, but do know they have to be reprogrammed (or adjusted) each season.
Don’t think you really grasped the point of my last post, but I suppose you could call it a kind of loophole, but you still have to apply and then be granted permission from the FCC to operate in such frequencies. It’s called a “Special Temporary Authority (STA). It is usually applied for emergency situations (but not exclusively), and in the case of Live Sports Radio, after each season the FCC issues new frequencies for each venue, and Live Sports Radio has to apply for licenses every year for each location.
“..STAs are granted with a fixed expiration date, usually six months, or for the term necessary to cover a special event, etc. STAs do not have grace periods and are valid only through their expiration date. ..”
If you really want to look into how they imparticular are doing it, google around for “Live Sports Radio LLC”. They’ve been doing it since American Express sponsored their first start up at the U.S. Tennis Open tournament in 2006. (Originally it was called “Ear Radio” for soccar games in Europe). Several College teams have used it (University of Michigan, Alabama, Florida, Michigan, Oklahoma State and Penn State.), as well as a few PGA tournaments. If you dig around you can find several FCC documentaions concerning Live Sports Radio operations.
But the bottom line is that Special Temporary Authority grants are not unlicenced operations, and have little application (if any) for for our music type stations, with exception perhaps to special events like a fair or something.
- October 16, 2019 at 12:18 am #113138
Well thanks for the information I’m still trying to see if any part 15 section 236 transmitters actually have came out yet as this is supposed to be the white space area. We’re getting closer to it just haven’t hit the nail on the head yet.
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