Thanks for the pictures, Winter, that helped to show what you're doing. In theory I can understand how it would work, the TV antenna picks up some of the signal and sends it out, like a passive radiator. There were cell phone antennas like that for the car, and stuck on the window they'd pick up your signal inside and re-radiate it through a whip antenna above the car, and they were supposed to work.
I've bought lots of those little transmitters over time, and range varies between brands bigtime, with one that shares a name with a famous router brand being the worst range I'd ever seen!
I found dollar store brands to be better, like Mp3 Gear, which Carl found to be a generic name, so they might be different transmitters inside. The best was a sale a few years ago at a department store, 'stocking stuffers" in red and white boxes on sell-out for $10. Those were the best, with such good range that a few friends bought them too and they all did well when adding an extension audio cable. They were no name, just FM transmitter, and had thermometers inside, so they were almost smart devices.
Yes, in my experience it cane be done on AM too, I can get out along the road for a pretty long stretch by carrier current. Found it by accident, using the Talkinghouse in the basement with the antenna by the power mainline. I grounded the Key on the back to a water pipe too. It goes down the road a long way, but not over open fields.
That may not work for anyone else, like if your lines are cladded... There's no guideline, every situation is different, the only way to know is to try it.
Worth Experimenting.
Rabbit Ear antenna's are made for VHF (Very High Frequency) AM sits comfy in MW (Medium Wave / LF Low Freqency). Taking into account most rabbit ear dipoles are significantly shorter than the 3 meter limit, they will be very inefficient. At full length Rabbit Ears tune to roughly 87.7 MHz. (I want to say their length only hits Channel 6 and not the rest of the VHF-Lo band)
One thing I would like to test out with this is, if I had a more powerful transmitter such as the Whole House Transmitter I would wonder if this may help increase the range much further.
The Whole House F Transmitter already can go 800-1,000 feet and with the extended antenna goes a little further. And if you read the tests it was posted as past part 15. But again getting back to the subject. You could probably exceed the range of the little transmitter even before pressing the cycle+mute button throwing it into high power mode (about 310 mW according to Tim's tests). Since your in a desert and getting over 1,000 feet at the high power mode I bet you'd hit 2 miles. In Frankinmuth, Michigan a Christmas Town there used a Whole House FM Transmitter for the music to the light display and I could hear it in STEREO and full quieting for about ½ mile and then it faded in and out to about a mile. I assume it was set to the regular low power (2mW into a rubber duck). The tin foil trick may not even work because it already uses a good antenna where the other transmitter uses a rather low end antenna and relies on the ground wire as an antenna. This is where the inductance helped you. Again experiment but I've tried similar stunts with my SainSonic and it did not work. I still say that a longer cable may do better on the $5 transmitter once you get a new one. Still a surprise here that your little transmitter done that far for range.
Ok sorry got some more questions 😛
So if I get Talking House AM I can probably get around 1-2 miles out of it with it inside and up at the top floor of my house? Also I assume the Talking House FM you are talking about the Whole House FM Transmitter?
May I also ask what transmitter are you talking about that will have the High and Low mode? Is this a FM or AM and is it legal for me to start a 24/7 station without a license?
With the cable are you talking about a extended aux cable?
Let’s say this new small cheap transmitter can get me a much further range is it legal for me to use this small cheap china one to run a station and will it still be part 15 compliment?
Thanks :>
Talking House is an AM Transmitter and Whole House is an FM Transmitter. As for the High power setting of the Whole House being legal? Most likely not as the out of box power is said to be a bit over the limit for part 15 which is 250 uV/M @ 3 meters however and this is debatable I'd say if your using the standard power where you live your unlikely to get an NOUO as Frankinmuth, Michigan has used it every day 24/7 for their Christmas station. The 3.0 is said to be even better than the Whole House 2.0. Now for the cable for the small Chinese transmitter. I'm talking about the AUX cable. Is it legal? Questionable. Since your getting the same range as the Whole House FM Transmitter which is certified and still 95% of the part 15 population who wants Range does use this one and to the best of my knowledge I've never heard of anyone with it getting a NOUO. Where you live in a desert I highly doubt there would be any trouble but technically it could break the certification for the transmitter if you use an extended cable. If you were to get a NOUO you have to write back right away and agree not to use that transmitter in the same way again. Be sure to not transmit over the top of an existing station. AM has lessor restrictions and yes the Talking House AM Transmitter can legally go a mile or two with a 6 foot prototype antenna that a friend and I are working together to get fully developed for part 15. But it does depend on the structure of the house. So if legality is a concern to you and you still want range AM is the way to go for now. New rules per the document I've read and the way I understand them could allow future use of an FM Transmitter at 87.9 Mhz at 50 mW which can go quite far and if it has a database sensor (from what I understand) would be 1 Watt. I still say that is more likely to be 50 mW or 500 mW. We need to stay tuned for that one. If your Chinese transmitter had a scan feature to check if the frequency was blank you'd be allowed 1 Watt (again from my understanding of the future proposal). In that case you could transmit legally at that time with your extended cable. Hope this gives you insight. Part 15 FM is harder to try and follow the rules. AM is far easier for those to have a desire to be 100% complaint and still have a nice range. Good Luck I'd like to hear how well you do.
So I’m guessing if the FCC catches you they will write a letter first warning you on what’s going on before the fees come?
So if you were me and looking for something to work out of the box and get close to a mile or two would you recommend the Talking House, or the Whole House transmitters?
About the FCC also I would like to state yes there is a pirate station running near me on 87.9. He gets the whole downtown area and is pretty popular. I’m not sure if any of you would recognize him but his call sign is KWFUCC. So my guessing is the FCC would go for him before me.
If I did get the Whole House 3.0 and set it on high how far of a range do you think I would get with the extended AUX cable? Also how would that help in range?
I know with AM I would need allot more things to setup from what I’m reading so I’m not really sure if I would want to go through that process yet until I become more familiar with this stuff.
In the other post you said "You could probably exceed the range of the little transmitter even before pressing the cycle+mute button throwing it into high power mode (about 310 mW according to Tim's tests). Since you’re in a desert and getting over 1,000 feet at the high power mode I bet you'd hit 2 miles." I am assuming you are talking about the Whole House and not the Talking house? If it is the Whole House I am guessing it would still be kind of legal and won’t get much attention from the FCC?
Sorry with all the questions 😛
Thanks =->
The RIAA, record labels, and artists have NOTHING to do with ASCAP, BMI and SESAC who pay the WRITERS of the songs. There is NO connection. Broadcasting terrestrial radio pays ONLY the song WRITERS through these organizations. Over the air radio DOES NOT in ANY WAY pay artists, labels or the RIAA. Except in the case where the writer is also the artist, and even then they are only getting the payment for the WRITING of the song, and nothing for the performance. The labels get 0 dollars from the three Performing Rights Organizations.
The RIAA and the record companies and artista HAVE indeed lobbies congress for the past 10 years or more to force radio to ALSO pay for the "performance" and add an additional cost to terrestrial radio. However the NAB (who you all sem to hate) has fought this tooth and nail every time it's come up in congress and so far have each time been able to maintain the status quo -- that we give FREE air time to the artists and record companies in exchange for the rights to play their music. This has NOTHING to do with paying the WRITERS of the songs, which is what ASCAP, BMI and SESAC do.
Remember, NO connection between writers royalties and the artists, labels and RIAA. Remember radio over the air pays ZERO dollars to the RIAA, the artists or the record labels. ZERO. So it's kind of silly to be torqued off at the RIAA and the labels when radio pays them NOTHING. They WANT us to pay more, but the NAB has managed to stop this every time. Darn those jerks at the NAB. We really need to get rid of them so they can't stop the labels from getting more money (sarcasm btw).
The PRO's (ASCAP, BMI, SESAC) distribute over 90% of monies collected to WRITERS.
TIB
You will never get much range legally out of a part 15 FM setup. 1000 feet would be illegal, 2 miles would be NOUO with fines territory.
If you have a PIRATE raising that much attention its best to stay OFF FM because it would draw attention to ANY slightly overpowered station. Its why I said for eveyone in NY, CT, FLA to use AM as these areas are known for Radio Pirates and therefore under the Radar as it is. ON AM you can legally get 2 miles with 100 mW and a good antenna. Station 8 is working now on a prototype antenna he got down to 5 foot so it can be used easily indoors and still out performs the long wire that comes with the Talking House. You could use the Talking House with the enclosed outdoor unit or a Procaster. Now that I heard about the PIRATE I think AM is best for you my friend to stay clear of any unwanted attention. And it will go far too. Let me know your results.
If you do use the little FM Transmitter or test it let me know what happens as my transmitter had to be turned off due to harmonics and spurs it was causing and I felt unsafe with it.
Ok ya on the FM band of 87.9 he is running. From what I read about his station he has been up for around a year now. I am unable to pick him up near me but if I got downtown I can get him. I am in a way surprised he hasn’t been caught by the FCC because some people with some radio equipment were curious on who was running it and found out hit address which also is posted somewhere online lol. If the FCC is mainly controlled by the state then it can make sense as the state I’m in does not get much of anything done lol.
Anyways back to some more questions 😛 (Sorry)
So I think I would be going AM due to a much better range without getting in trouble and when you do read about the FCC raiding stations it’s mainly FM not AM.
So the questions I got are, if I get the Talking House would I get better range putting it upstairs or downstairs? The reason I ask this is because some people say to put it in a basement which is something I don’t have.
Another question I have is what’s the best way to find an open frequency on the AM band. I have used radio-locator.com but they only show open frequencies on the FM band. Sorry if that sounds like a noob question.
When you say you can get legally 2 miles with a good antenna I’m guessing I can upgrade the wire antenna or use an external one? Will the ATU be able to work with another antenna also?
Last question now is if I try out FM would it still be legal to use the cheap car one with the TV antenna?
Thanks 😕
the higher the better in micropower! Get that Talking House as high up as you can get it.
So I did some looking around and found something interesting. There is a product called Select-A-Tenna AM which can help boost an AM single. What I am curious is can this help boost the single of a Talking House Transmitter to get much better range? Also has anyone ever done this experiment before?
Thanks 😉
I have thought of that many times. Those tunable loops(terk and grundig have them too), are coils tuned to the AM band frequencies and frequency adjustable for peaking. Isn't it the same as the loading coil you construct for the outdoor antenna? I think if you inserted it between the transmitter and the 10 foot wire you would have better results....and you can peak it with the tuning cap and have a good indoor antenna.
Seems that this is a larger loop with less turns of wire as opposed to the one you construct around a 3" PVC pipe....more turns with less diameter. End result inductance is the same and this is done for you already and is tunable. But with the talking house the internal Auto-tuning may not work if you do this.
Have never tried but on paper should work.
Mark
Ok so ya after I do my mini FM transmitter test and if any of the eBayers respond to me about their TH I will test it out and see what happens.
When you said "Seems that this is a larger loop with less turns of wire as opposed to the one you construct around a 3" PVC pipe...." I never made one before lol. The only thing I so far have made/built was the TV antenna and the cheap car FM transmitter. I am thinking of doing two test with it. Test 1 would be to put the Select-A-Tenna next to the TH AM transmitter antenna and make it point out of my window and see what the range would be. I will also set it to whatever frequency I will be using on the TH. Test 2 would be similar but this time I will put it next to my car radio or hand held radio and drive maybe a half a mile and see if I can pick up my station. From what I so far heard with the TH is I can get around .2-.5 miles of readable reception with the wire antenna. If I use the Select-A-Tenna it may help give it a boost making me pick up my station further than .2 or even .5 miles. I guess I will post this when I get the transmitter and the results but for now I am going to do my last test with the FM transmitter and the TV antenna. I will keep you all posted once I do this.
🙂