I have Sangeon ATS 505 which covers the same range.
As of this time I have not tried an outdoor antenna, so I don't know what would happen, but as an indoor radio it does very well.
"External" could also refer to the fishing-tackle like antenna "reel" that comes with the radio, which can be hung indoors for about 10-feet.
Long wave is the weirdest place.
My Kaito 1103 is a fantastic performer
on the AM BCB but not good on longwave.
My Icom R-70 does an OK job there. I
have heard France (LW AM BCB) on 162 kHz,
but you
need a really long antenna wire, and
you need a quiet RF environment. Or a
really good loop.
I heard 3 longwave NDB beacons on
my Heathkit GR-81, with a 100 foot wire.
The GR-81 is a 3 tube regen from the 1960s.
(Really 2 tubes if you don't count the
rectifier.) That was just LAST WEEK.
One beacon was in Nova Scotia, one was
in North Carolina, and I haven't checked
where the third one is yet. These beacons
run 25 to 50 watts, I think.
My Sony 2010 is pretty good on longwave,
but you have to take it outside, and
rotate the radio until it's internal loopstick
faces in the right direction. (Unless you
plug in an external antenna.) On Cape Cod,
I have heard many European broadcast stations
on that receiver.
The AquaGuide 905 (?) which my friend got at
a tag sale (for about 10 dollars)is very sensitive
down there. Here in West Hartford, CT, in the
RF noisy suburbs, I have heard 5 or 6 longwave
BC stations from Europe.
This is in the back yard using the
loop antenna on top of the radio. This receiver
was meant for use on a boat, I guess, but it
does not have a BFO - so it only gets BC stations.
The strongest BC station I have ever heard, was
on 171 kHz, in the house! I can't remember what
country it was. (This was last year, hence the
name of this thread, I think.)
We had a friend in New Haven, CT,
who operated a Part 15 cw beacon in the
160 - 190 range. The "callsign" was SAL.
He had a 50 foot tower and a great ground
system. New Haven is about 25 miles from
here. We heard the beacon plain as day without
any problem in an apartment in the city with
a long wire antenna.
There were 2 receivers that were tried.
One was an ICOM R-71 (not an R-70) and the
other receiver was a Yeasu FRG-7700. The
7700 was not a great longwave performer by
itself, but we had a Grove TUN-3 preselector.
Man - when that preselector got tuned in right,
the beacon just jumped out of the noise.
Also, I had a borrowed Palamar longwave converter
in the 1980s that was excellent. It converted
10 kHz - 500 kHz up to the 3 or 4 MHz range. I
can't remember exactly what range - there were
different models for different ranges - and it
was too long ago. (My feeble brain can't remember
back that far.)
All of the nearby LW NDB or nav beacons that I heard as
a kid have been turned off and dismantled.
However, judging from my experience with the
minimal Heathkit GR-81 regenerative receiver
last week -
and this radio is just a few stages above
a crystal set - there still are LW beacons
to be heard. These signals were just barely
audible, but I did hear them, and again, I
was using the same Grove TUN-3 preselector
from 30 years ago. The TUN-3 pretty much
tunes out most of the spectrum and just lets
a little bit in around where you are tuned,
so the radio's front end doesn't get clobbered
by AM BCB stations. (Again, for this I was
using a 100 foot random wire.)
The BBC runs English language programming on
198 kHz. And I have heard them, weakly, here.
(Not on the GR-81.)
Unfortunately there is a beacon from North
Carolina right on top of them. They are the
only English language station that I know of
in the whole 153 to 279 (?) LW BCB band. And
of course, my favorite LWBC station is Iceland
on 189. They are a real hoot with their Nordic(?)
language and their folk music.
That is the extent of my longwave receiving
experience. But I may have to rig up a
serious receiving installation here just to see
what is really going on.
Today, in 2012, the longwave receivers that
are sought after are the software driven
rigs and (apparently) the very good ICOM R-75.
It's a challenge. A lot of the good stuff to
hear is just over the noise (or just under it.)
The Long Wave Club Of America is very good. If
I was devoting more time to this, I would be
a member of that organization.
Basically, if you have a portable
radio that tunes the LW
range, just take it out in the backyard at
night and try it. If it is pretty good, you
might hear some LW NDB beacons. (You will
need a BFO.) Heck, an RF signal generator
can be used for that.
Nothing you hear will be strong, unless you
are right next door to it.
If you have a table top receiver, try hooking
up some wire and throwing it outside.
The main thing is to just try things. The worst
that will happen is you will hear nothing, as in
my otherwise excellent Kaito 1103, or you will
get a bunch of crud, noise, hash, and images of
AM BCB stations.
You can also pull the main breaker on your house
if you are really crazy (which I have done.) That
gets rid of a lot of noise junk. But your receiver
will have to run on batteries. (It would be just
like me to shut the house off and then plug in
the ICOM R-70.) (Huh!?)
Best Wishes,
Bruce, DOGGRADIO STUDIO 2
P.S. Oh yeah - the longwave station
on 171 kHz was in Morrocco. (Argh, I
can't spell, but you know what I mean.)
This was last year, IN THE HOUSE, on
the 10 dollar yard sale AquaGuide 905.
Conditions must have been really
really good!
If I had my druthers, my preference,
I would go to the boys at North Country
Radio and ask about their Long Wave Receiving
converter which covers 10 kHz up to about
500 kHz. They also have an active antenna
for receiving. It might be a kit, I don't know.
I think the receiving converter can be purchased
ASSEMBLED for around $120. The LF-90 cw, bpsk (?)
1 watt transmitter is where I would start. I
wouldn't be trying AM, at least not right away.
I think the transmitter is available, assembled,
for about the same price as the receiving converter,
but I'm not sure.
I'm think you could Google those items
mentioned above, and see what experienced
longwave experimenters think about them.
I have a feeling the above mentioned units
might be pretty good,
although I really don't know. But I do
have a North Country Radio MPX-96 FM transmitter,
and it is very good. Speaking of that particular
Part 15 FM transmitter - a friend built it for
me in California. It runs about 10 mW out. You
can also build it to run 100 mW out. In my opinion,
both these power levels are too high to
comply with Part 15.239, however, here at
DOGGRADIO STUDIO 2, I run my MPX-96 into a
bunch of attenuators. That feeds my indoor
FM dipole. I have tried 1 mW and 0.1 mW
power levels from the attenuators - to my
indoor dipole on the first floor. I think
this complies with Part 15.239. I am running
0.1 mW to the antenna right now, because -
well - I tend to be low profile. Most of my
audience listened to the AM transmitter when
it was on. The MPX-96 kit's assembly requires
an experienced builder, from what I understand.
The transmitter has a lot of discrete components.
Oh yeah,
the MPX-96 can be modified to do mono. I am
using mono with mine. I have a switch that
can toggle between stereo and mono. My friend
in California did the mono/stereo switch mod.
OOps, gotta go.
Bruce, DRS2
There is a Part 15 160 - 190 guy
who is using a 30 foot antenna -
not 50. It is shorter, but he
does get results.
I think it's a wire. Heck, nobody
cares if you use a top hat down there.
Really. Nobody cares at all. A lot
of the guys use gigantic top hats.
A top hat can be wires going off in
different directions to trees or
whatever. They just have to be
arranged correctly so each wire cancels
out the wire on the other side. That
way the top hat doesn't radiate.
I think this guy is on YOUTUBE. Maybe
I can find him.
Bruce, DRS2
Best Wishes,
Bruce, DOGGRADIO STUDIO 2
Uh, hey - it's me.
Did you fall into the hole
where the ground rod goes?
You must be pretty thin.
Best Wishes,
Bruce, DRS2
4 AM here in the tool shed and just took a spin across the LW dial, only heard a distant beacon.
Really intend to go forward with Deep Voice, the long wave transmitter designed by members of this website. It is almost ready, but lacks an oscillator that can be driven by RFB's proposed PLL circuit.
The oscillator will arrive eventually but I am concerned about the antenna requirement. I am not comfortable with a 50-foot antenna that could collapse on a neighbors yard.
What we want is an ingeniously clever smaller antenna that will work well on the long waves.
So you heard a beacon - on your
Sangean 505?
You know, so many radios are just
SO DEAD down there. If you can
describe the Morse code you heard,
or tell me the frequency, I can
probably figure out where it is.
Maybe we can look up the power of
the transmitter.
This is what I think. It's hard
enough to get a Part 15.219 AMer
going.
I think this really has to be done
in "baby steps." What I would do is:
Well, if the transmitter's output is
50 ohms, then a one watt fifty ohm
resister will get warm or hot. Then
you know you have power. I guess
before even that, somebody has got
to figure out what the output
impedance of the Deep Voice is. Then
I would run a fifty foot wire out of
a window, and put the transmitter
right next to the window. Maybe
you could ground the transmitter to
a radiator, so something. So you
might have to take some length off
of the antenna to be legal. Is this
something you could do for starters?
On YouTube there is a guy using a
30 foot antenna stick, from the ground up.
He probably just couldn't go any higher.
He has a gigantic loading coil on the
thing, but it works. So maybe eventually
you could put up a stick that is shorter
than 50 feet. But for now, this is just
experimenting time, right?
Last night I heard one LW beacon on my
GR-81 regenerative two tube (if you don't
count the rectifier) receiver. Being a
radio minimalist, to me that was really fun.
Anyway, if you can get me the frequency,
maybe we can figure out where this beacon
is that you heard.
So back to the Deep Voice transmitter -
the thing is, if you can load up
a fifty foot wire, that will be half
of the battle. Right now, we are just
looking for data on how the thing is
going to be working.
Am I making sense? I was at the office
really late last night. I should go
back to sleep. I'm sort of rambling
along here.
Best Wishes,
Bruce, DRS2
Enjoyed your all night talk show, Doggradio 2, and here are several replies.
The beacon being received here on the shores of the Mississippi just downstream from Hannibal, Missouri, is on 225kHz with call sign FZ (dot dot dash dot space dash dash dot dot).
The Big Talker transmitter has a 50-ohm output from a final stage designed by Radio8Z, as can be seen here
http://www.kdxradio.com/deepvoice.html
The driver, also designed by radio8Z, is from the Big Talker SW transmitter.
Version 1.0.0 shows an oscillator borrowed from a diagram whose link seems to be dead.
Version 2.0.0 shows the PLL circuit proposed by RFB, but lacking an appropriate oscillator.
Good to hear from you. (I see LPH # 30
is up - I'll be checking that out soon.)
So when you get the LW transmitter done,
yup, I'd stick it on a 50 ohm resistor -
take your readings, and see if the
resistor gets hot. And you can check
the Amplitude Modulation. And if it was
me, I'd start with a 50 foot horizontal
wire antenna. I know the transmitter
isn't done, but that's what I would do -
when the time comes anyway.
I've been trying to figure out the
power of the beacon FZ. There don't
seem to be any lists on that. Do
you know how far away it is from you?
Meanwhile, I'll keep trying to see how
powerful it is. I guess it could be
25 watts, or it could be 1000 or 2000.
I'm not too savvy in the longwave game.
It's a really weird place down there.
Best Wishes,
Bruce, DRS2
Somewhere back in the threads, maybe even on this long one, I once before reported receiving FZ beacon signal and I think it was either MRAM or Radio8Z who pointed out a listing somewhere of beacon stations, call letters, frequencies and powers.
I'll dig around.
Me, too,
Bruce, DRS2
P.S. Me, too.
"It is almost ready, but lacks an oscillator that can be driven by RFB's proposed PLL circuit."
I believe I sent you schematics to simple oscillators which can be built using junk parts and can be used with the DataKit PLL board.
It's a matter of simply building it, testing it, and applying it.
The DataKit manual has several oscillator circuit examples that could be used as well.
RFB
My memory may have flipped, but I thought the oscillators you sent were for the MW band at a time when I was considering adding PLL to the LPB CC transmitter.
I think I would have remembered if I'd been sent a LW oscillator.
But I will go back in time and double-check.
The oscillators can be used for either MW or LW. Its a matter of simply changing their resonance range via the LC tank and conductive curves of the active element in the circuit..ie the transistor or tube.
What is needed is a simple free running CW oscillator controlled by a varactor pair or single ended via the PLL and the oscillator driving the buffer stage prior to the final.
Any one of those within the DataKit manual can be modified for LW use. Those I sent and or linked to for oscillators in the MW band can also be easily changed for LW.
Primary things to change...LC tank and active component, though a 2n2222A will do just fine on either band.
Mix and match, overcome and adapt. That is part of the hobby and part of the discovery and learning process. You may just surprise yourselves.
RFB